Thanks!

Lots of words from someone who is somehow too busy to read a comment that completely deflated their argument, yet not too busy to write a bunch of nothing elsewhere.

Which comment? I don't know what you're talking about. Link it and I'll read it. I might have gotten to it by now if I didn't have so many people getting pissy with me for not taking the time to comb every single comment.

Theres not a lot of good faith about your behavior, especially not when you make "hey, why did you respond to this comment in this thread instead of the other comment in the same thread, when what you claim to care about is validity of claims? Thats really weird" out to be "hey why dont you read everything written at all times everywhere?"

Because not everyone coming at me about it is acting like it's a curiosity. People are trying to frame me as a bot or troll because it just so happened that the one source I saw and took the time to check wasn't great. I moved on at that point and figured if there was a solid source, someone would link it. Nobody bothered to link ANYTHING else, but they're all mad I didn't read their favorites.

Normally when you types want to claim some civil faux pas has been committed so you can act offended, you at least have the presence of mind to not make yourselves out to be obvious hypocrites in the very same text.

My bad, I sometimes let myself get sucked into arguments by assholes online when I really ought to be doing something else. Terribly sorry my personal fault didn't align with how you think I should be spending my time.

Be specific if you want me to read them so bad. I haven't been back to the thread because every time I open my phone, I have more notifications from people upset that I didn't read everything in the thread as if that was an act of malice instead of a fact of time. Just link the comment you're talking about, and I'll try to get them. But if you just want to accuse me of malice for not devoting my day to the thread, I'm running out of patience for that.

What about the other sources that don’t frame it in this way, surely you’re taking those into account as well?

Oh I'm sorry, I didn't realize that just because I wanted to read one article, I was contractually obligated to evaluate every single fucking link in the thread. My bad, should I just not engage at all if I have limited time? How many hours of my day do I need to block out before I open a thread on lemmy.ml? Give me a specific figure so I know what's expected of me. Because I'm clearly not allowed to leave without evaluating the contents of every single comment on the post.

The fact you put that little .ml bit in there tells me you are focused on the online discourse and campist internet community drama.

Or it's because 95% of .ml accounts are arrogant know-it-alls who, whether they're correct or not, are 100% convinced that they have everything figured out and expect to be taken at their word blindly. Go ahead, try to question any common opinion on .ml or Hexbear with an account from an outside instance and see how that goes for you. You don't have to be rude, just politely ask for sources on claims. Disagreeing or merely asking for information before agreeing in those spaces is tantamount to sacrilege.

It’s always, that’s not a swastika, even if it was it’s not anymore, even if it still is those pictures are old, even if they are new they’re unverifiable, even if they’re verified they’re only a few Nazis, even if it’s a lot of Nazis, the Azov itself isn’t Neo Nazi anymore, and even if they Are Nazis it’s justified because Russia is worse.

Funny you bring this one up because this is great example of topics that get .ml/Hexbear users all arrogant and nasty. I had to ask at least six times to get a source on that claim. I got SO much abuse for not just blindly accepting a few pics of a few dozen dudes as proof they run the country, and it's not like I came in and accused them of lying. I just asked in multiple threads for a good source on the topic. I got dozens of responses, the vast majority of them rather nasty, and finally, a SINGULAR PERSON bothered to step up and actually provide a source.

So the impression that I get as an outsider is very much that yes, .ml and Hexbear users fully expect to be blindly taken at their word, and they fully expect us to critically distrust just about anything from outside their bubble. They'll insist they behave otherwise, but the second you start asking for hard sources for claims around here, you 100% will receive more insults and accusations of supporting Nazis/Zionism than you will sources. If someone provides a poor source for the claim and you come to that conclusion after critically evaluating, even if you're right that the source is shit, you 100% will receive even more insults and accusations of supporting Nazis/Zionism.

communists and socialists are the most informed, politically literate people on here.

most of them provide ample sources when possible.

Which is easy in when it concerns history and some clown for example thinks he’s clever because he throws in a Molotov-Ribbentrop pact.

Knowledgeable communists will invariably give at least 10 countries with dates for when they made a pact with the nazis.

For the sake of argument, I'll give you that one uncontested. The capitalists sure as hell aren't on point here, so let's just assume you're right here. Problem is that the part about providing ample sources just doesn't hold here on Lemmy, at least. I have faced a LOT of hostility for asking for sources on claims here. Not for accusing them of lying. For asking for more information before agreeing with them.

it’s all insults and belittlement 90% of the time.

Now that’s factually untrue.

I can only imagine it’s you who’s been butthurt for being corrected when spouting the most idiotic nonsense.

So you think what you want, stay in your info BS circle jerk and fuck off.

Oh really? Just try to get good info on the claim that Ukraine is full of or run by Nazis. If you're not prepared to accept a grand total of 4 pics of maaaaybe 50 dudes if we round very generously as proof that the entire country is rife with them, you'll get abused for not just accepting it. I forget how many times I had to ask, but it was at least 6 times I wandered into threads about it and asked for more information before I got a single fucking person who was willing to link ANYTHING of significance. That singular individual willing to share quality information was balanced by at least 15-20 people who just wanted to insult and belittle me instead. And it's not like I came in accusing them of being full of shit. I just asked for more detailed sources that could support the claims they were making.

But here you are proving my point. I actually acknowledged the abuse hurled my way, and what do I get for it? I get accused of a fragile ego that can't take criticism.

Since that was your reaction to the idea that the war could end by Russia withdrawing from Ukraine

Oh sorry I didn't know I was supposed to treat that like a serious suggestion lmao. Why don't we give everyone a pony while we're at it? If this is a serious proposition of yours, that a peace requires Russia to withdraw, then you are in fact demanding people fight to the death. So go do that. Go volunteer.

Buddy, I want the war to end. In the real world that happens with a peace treaty, which comes quite much faster if we're not supplying arms to one side. I'm not for giving either side money or arms or lives, but you are.

But I gotta say, this doesn't really seem like a cogent answer you're giving me. Thinking that the war should end now is somehow demanding people fight to the death for Russia.

despite my mouth being unfrothed.

They said, while proposing an insane ultimatum that cannot be brought to fruition.

despite my mouth being unfrothed.

They said when met with the idea that Ukraine should be allowed the peace treaty it has already sought with Russia twice before, and they then reacted with imperious demands of something that will not happen, knowing that the alternative to peace is just forcing ukrainians to fight to the death.
Go volunteer dude.

despite my mouth being unfrothed

They said while arguing that wanting peace now instead of forcing people to fight to the death so they can feel like they're winning a HOIV game is somehow the same as wanting people to fight to the death

I assume you can see that as well?

Well, no. Russia invaded after 8 years of breaches of treaties, 8 years of shelling and ethnic cleansing carried out by nazi paramilitaries supported by the ukrainian government. I actually think we should not go back to that status quo. I think ethnic cleansing and pogroms are bad, I think bloodshed is bad, so, you know, I would not want to do that.

And this is not even getting into the reality of what would happen if you somehow did manage to just have a population give up and go home after massive gains because some dumbass online thinks that's how peace negotiations work. I think you understand such an action would likely lead to the collapse of the Russian Republic, leading to further bloodshed. Not to mention what would happen in a Ukraine if you suddenly just gave nazis free reign after arming and funding them for years, leaving them in a country that basically already is collapsed. Great recipe for yet more bloodshed. Lets get a ukrainian taleban up and running, sounds awesome dude.
I have a feeling you understand how ridiculous your suggestion is on every level and you don't care about the lives of ukrainians or russians.

Ignoring that, your idea is also just... not realistic. If we're playing pretend, why stop there. I say we give every eastern european their own castle and one billion dollars and one hundred puppies. Why do you think ukrainians shouldn't have access to puppies? Why do you think eastern europeans don't deserve to live in castles? Why do you hate life?