alessandro
PC GamingReddit will post this soon then the Nintendo lawyers will be coming for these poor people.
I wonder if there ever be LLM capable of assisting with this.
Since it's all patterns between words, it should be theoretically possible to train model specialized in decompiling assembly into source code...
I'm ready to hide a remote mine in a toilet. Let's go.
It's gonna be so weird playing this at non-slideshow framerates. Wonder if I'll even still like it lol
Most n64 emulators have a mode to up the core speed so games like this run at a good rate.
You can already with the XBLA remaster. Can play in old graphics or new.
I completed it on 00 Agent and now I can't go back to the n64 original
I tried to replay it a few years ago and it's just so dated that it wasn't fun anymore. The auto-aim mechanic feels really awkward compared to modern shooters.
Did you play the homemade goldeney for pc? It's pretty legit, needs more players
https://www.geshl2.com/
Unlike with the other N64 decomps, this time the genre evolved drastically. It might be rough.
Perfect dark is fucking sick on PC I'll bet GoldenEye is too
What N64 decompilation projects exist where the genre didn't evolve drastically? Are you saying games like Mario 64 and OoT are representative of modern platformers/action rpgs?
Mario 64? Kinda yeah, because the Mario franchise has been more or less alone in the 3D platformer space, and everything since 64 has either been expansions on it like Sunshine, Galaxy and Odyssey, or that time they made the same 2D-but-in-a-3D-engine game 5 or 6 times. New Super Mario 3D World Land Wii U Switch.
Ocarina of Time is kind of similar: the classic Zelda franchise is kind of alone, especially after the 16 bit era ended nothing has really played like a Zelda game. They've only made like six of them; OoT got the formula almost perfectly right on the first try even if they were pretty much just re-implementing ALttP in 3D. Majora's Mask took the same engine and assets and made a heartburn simulator. I personally think it's less pleasant to play because of the constant time pressure but it's the most interesting one to study. Wind Waker returns to the formula with the sailing gimmick as "we gotta do something different" and as a way to mask loading screens. Twilight Princess was a reaction to fan clap back at Wind Waker's perceived childishness, it's basically OoT again, It's also the most blatantly unfinished. Skyward Sword is just Wind Waker but worse. The control scheme is hideous. You can feel Nintendo corporate breathing down the necks of the dev team talking about "we went full Japanese on motion controls this console generation and the best we have to show for it is the pack-in bowling demo. Put in as many motion controls as possible, even if the joystick would make more sense. After that they gave up and started making Just Cause games.
You didn't really make much of a case for those genres not evolving drastically, but kind of just went on a rant about Zelda games for a minute. Starting with Mario, there have been plenty of full 3D platformers out there. Crash Bandicoot, Spyro, Jak and Daxter, Ratchet and Clank just to name a few. Arguably the genre as a whole has fallen out of favor, but even so there has never been a shortage of games in the genre, at least some of which would introduce their own unique mechanics and innovations.
And Zelda? Are you one of those people who actually think Ocarina of Time has aged well? There has been plenty of others, such as Alundra, Elemental Gimmick Gear, Darksiders, Psychonauts, Beyond Good and Evil, and Okami. Speaking of evolution specifically, while Metroid is primarily credited as creating the "metroidvania" subgenre, it has to be noted that Metroid itself was directly influenced by Zelda and the subgenre as a whole is really just sidescrolling Zelda clones. But the advent of that subgenre is one such example of one of the directions the genre as a whole has evolved.
In terms of modern games, I would argue Star Wars Fallen Order, and Survivor, have both scratched more of the Zelda-style itch than Zelda games have in years.
And this isn't even getting into all the indie games out there. CrossCode is both a stellar action rpg as well as having distinct Zelda-like puzzle elements. A Hat in Time seems to have gotten relatively popular for a 3D platformer. Apparently Spongebob games keep being churned out. Celeste. Yoku's Island Express. Yooka-Laylee. Sonic games keep coming out. LittleBigPlanet. It Takes Two. Neon White. The Rayman series.
It's so easy to think of examples of games that have refined or pushed the envelope in those genres in many ways, since Mario 64, and OoT came out. All of these genres have become much more since then.
Mario 64 is still a very recommendable 3D platformer (a genre that sees only a handful releases every year) that aged really well; Starfox 64 was just released again with better graphics because the game's still good (in a genre that's basically dead); OoT and MM are still peak Zelda in a very rather small pool of Zelda-likes (not action RPGs). So yes, I don't see much development in any of these areas.
Halo was the first console FPS with decent controls. I said it. They’re all borderline unplayable before that.
Using the c buttons to aim was super clunky
Halo was not the first fps with good dual analog controls, just one of the first that was as popular as Halo was.
Oh yeah??? I'd like to see my sister slap me to death until I cry on Halo!
I don't think this is controversial. Halo is the first game that managed an actually useful but still subtle aim assist that allowed playing a shooter with an analog controller to actually feel good.
Time Splitters
007 Goldeneye N64 did have (surprisingly modern) dual stick control layouts ... but it required 2 controllers. Of course it was ruined by how shitty the stock N64 controller was, never-mind having to hold one in each hand.
Here's a video of someone playing with the "2.2 Galore" control style
The only benefit to the N64 controller was that because it only had one stick, you could use 3 fingers of your hand on the stick rather than a thumb only. Way better control over the cursor than just a thumb.
All FPS controller-based controls are inferior to keyboard+mouse. It just depends on how much hampering you can tolerate. People who played Doom on PC and adapted to Goldeneye were already making an alt control scheme work (although technically you could use 2 controllers to get a similar layout to Halo controls) because the game was good enough to warrant it at the time.
Of course the Halo twin stick controls were/are superior to the weird N64 controller, but none of them have "decent" controls once you're used to m+kb. I even played a bit of Goldeneye 20 years after release and had fun with it--muscle memory kicked in and it was fine.
All FPS controller-based controls are inferior to keyboard+mouse.
Yes. This is why I never really liked Goldeneye that much. Just never got the big deal.
Halo is the first one that I thought was decent. I didn't say it had good controls, I said decent 😂
Did you play Doom or something? GoldenEye predates basically every 3d shooter. It's controls suck today even for controller standards but it did a lot for the FPS genre.. more than halo ce.
I give it 3 days before the first big booba mod is released
Pierce Brosnan with tits?
Candy Kong Mode
Might need to give it a bit longer than that. There isn't a PC port.
Doesn’t decompiling games make it easy to port? I’m admittedly not an expert on it
In some ways yes.
Decompiling a game means reverse engineering the game to a point that you have a program written in C that compiles to identical machine code as the commercial release. That makes it easier, but not entirely straightforward, to just compile the game for another architecture, because it might be written for hardware-specific features that might not be present on, say, PC.
A minor example is Mario Kart 64 has these big screens around some tracks that are playing footage of the race. That relies on a hardware quirk peculiar to the N64 and it's been difficult if not impossible to get it working anywhere but real hardware.
A really weird one is Super Mario 64. The retail version of the game was apparently compiled with debug flags on. The game has been decompiled, and then compiling it without the debug flag actually causes the game to run smoother, particularly in Dire Dire Docks which chugs so bad on a retail cartridge that speed runners use camera strategies to keep the submarine out of view for better performance.
Decompilation means that they can deterministically recompile the code and get the original ROM back minus assets. Someone may be able to wedge in shims of emulator code for the subsystems that need it. But at that point you're still emulating realistically and still dealing with bottlenecks. The true power of a native Port would open it up to Modern graphics apis larger faster system bus etc that wasn't available initially. It's going to take a bit more programming work before you see something that really blows the doors off emulation. But it will happen.
It certainly makes it easier but I don't know if I'd say it's easy. There's still work to be done to make it run natively on PC with the kinds of settings you'd expect to see on a PC game.
Having the source code makes it trivial to do whatever you want with the code. Working through an emulator is not fun from a coding perspective.
Absolutely not true. I guarantee there is a lot of code, especially hacky code, written specifically for the N64's hardware. Even if you port it to a modern PC, you're still going to have to address a bunch of unexpected behavior that relied on the quirks of the hardware. Graphics effects in particular are known for this.
Source code means you can refactor it to preserve that graphics. But realistically that's unlikely if nobody wants to put the effort in
Why would you work through the emulator? You modify the source rom.
Rom hacks have existed since the GB era of games, that’s not even using an emulator, played straight on the GB with a hacked cart.
Very simply, the source ROM is code that isn’t readable in that way. The emulator interpolates the ROM binary. While ROM hacking is a thing, it’s done through hijacking the emulator’s/platform’s API calls.
Imagine having an audiobook as an MP3, but you want to rewrite chapter 8. You have all the words, you can hear them, but you don’t have the script. You have to transcribe everything first in order to have the book text. From there, you can edit what the book says, but it’d be easier if you just had the text in the first place.
Uhh, no, you literally modify the source rom, if you have the source code for the console it’s child’s play. Lots are made with dev kits, or their stolen code.
And you don’t use an emulator at all. What you’re suggesting means that game could only be played on a singular emulator with a particular bios setting. You could do that, but why?
I’m comparing ROM hacking to decompilation. Decomp completely renders the full source code as readable and compilable for new binaries. ROM hacking doesn’t go that far.
Roms and emulators aren’t that complicated.
Odd Job looking similar to this?
I was not prepared for this when i open the thread.
Dibs on oddjob.
Yeah, but with it decompiled we can make every character oddjob size. With DK Head mode.
We could even make a dick head mode!
Don’t threaten me with a good time.
I always liked Oddjob. Didn’t occur to me until years later that he had a smaller hitbox.
Oddjob was banned in multiplayer at my friends house. Good times
Fighting words I know, but the best shooter on the N64 was NOT GoldenEye 007.
Jetforce Gemini, baby!!
Controls were dogshit, but then so were most games' from that era.
The best shooter on the N64 was Perfect Dark.
It was GoldenEye but massively upgraded.
In hindsight I have no idea how I managed to play it this much at such absolutely horrendous FPS, but I burned hundreds of hours in that game. The bot AI was surprisingly good in local matches.
The only thing Goldeneye had better was higher framerate. And yes, I played against bots for countless hours. Except DarkSims. They were cheaters.
You all are forgetting banjo tooie!
Famous shooter Banjoe Tooie.
Wave Race 64
Here is my wishlist. Thank you in advance. :D
- stable 120 fps
- up to 8 drivers on track
- editor: custom league with custom rules and earned points, each course settings such as reverse, weather and even custom placement for the buoy
- textures touched up for playing on modern display
A dog with a jet pack and a gun. What’s not to love?
I remember I recently replayed GoldenEye for the N64 at a local brewery and not knowing how to shoot someone. I was so used to modern controls that I felt disoriented playing the old controls.
I wish there was a mod that tried to mimic modern controls.
For real, I have a 8BitDo N64 controller conversation kit to make it a BT controller with a hall effect stick. Does not change a thing. Mario Kart's controls are atrocious as the controls are for most games. I guess the 3Cs are hard when you are the first generation of 3D games.
I never had the pleasure of owning an N64. I remember renting a machine when I was a kid and playing Super Mario. Is there any games you recommend for my retroarch machine?
Dude you have to get ship of harkinian if you never played oot
Absolute musts are Zelda: Ocarina of Time and Zelda: Majora's Mask. Otherwise stick with the rest of the popular ones and you'll be alright - Mario 64, Donkey Kong 64. Star Wars had a few good ones - Rogue Squadron, Shadows of the Empire (janky as fuck, probably didn't age all that well, but was pretty innovative for its time), Episode 1 Racer (although if you're also emulating PS2 games, Star Wars Racer Revenge is much better imo).
Jetforce Gemini ofc, but I'm not kidding about the controls being dogshit - proceed only if you're willing to completely rewire your perception of which buttons are supposed to perform which actions.
Some multiplayer greats are Super Smash Bros and Gauntlet Dark Legacy.
IIRC Aero Gauge was a decent racer, although the SW ones are better.
Kirby Crystal Shards was a solid 64 adaptation.
...I think at this point I'm just rattling off what I can remember from my own collection, lol. The nostalgia juices are really flowing!
Mario 64, Perfect Dark, Banjo-Kazooie, Conquer's Bad Fur Day, Starfox 64, Mario Party, Pokémon Snap. The problem is most games have a GC sequel that was a massive improvement, like Super Smash Bros and Mario Kart, or they were dogshit but I was too young to know better. I end up playing more SNES games on my handheld emulator system because they couldn't improve 2D games after 3D was doable.
The other comments have good suggestions, but I'll Add Rogue Squadron. Ogre Battle 64 is also good if you like strategy RPGs.
Really never played another game quite like Ogre Battle 64, that one was great.
Check out Unicorn Overlord. It's been touted as the spiritual successor to Ogre Battle, and I agree.
Oh nice, never heard of that one, thanks. I just revisit Ogre Battle 64 on the emulator every few years haha.
Duke Nukem and obviously Golden eye were our two favorite PvP shooting games on the N64... not sure I'd recommend it for the single player tho
Hell ya, there are dozens of us that are on your side! Recently started a play through that I pick up from time to time on emulator. The controls are way worse than I remember lol.
4K texture mods let's go
Should've done Perfect Dark instead. Hopefully it can be next!
Not only was it already done, it then got ported to PC in 2160p 4K UHD https://github.com/perfect-dark-pc-port/perfect_dark
And there's a vr port! Got me to do a full playthrough the other week.
The Perfect Dark decomp runs great on the Steamdeck also. Now I can spend hours fragging those idiot sims.
Funny that this happens right around the time Agent64 comes out.
We're about to see the pokemon brown of 007.
I'm somewhat scared to ask,
What is pokemon brown?
An ancient romhack, that got updated 2yra.
Basically Zephyr@transphobe_instance implies decomp007 might get a drastric remix project.
Unlike PerfectDark “brown” already in the works.
Sidebar, what's up with the transphobia thing?
OT
One of your admins is on a anti-trans campaign.
Many of us are moving communities from SJW because of it.
Good to know. I don't like that being attached to my username though. I would appreciate it if you changed that at least for now or added it not in direct context to my username. Don't want the people who are unaware assuming that's meant for me.
CX. Lmk if it reads better.
🤞 you find a new instance.
