It hasn't disappeared. It's still exists, it's just that if you get it modern antibiotics can kill it.

You still have a 5-15% chance of dying with modern antibiotics.

It's the improvement in sanitary practices that ultimately made it a much lesser issue.

Also it hasn't disappeared. You can friggin catch it right now if you want

The word "quarantine" originates from a Venetian policy that every single ship had to wait outside of port for 40 days to ensure nobody had the plague. I'm sure the antivax people would have no problem with such measures?

It did not cause imaginary autism though.

Also it didn't disappear?

These people are just willfully ignorant and deeply faithful.

The black plague is common in Madagascar for example, in villages which can't be reqxhes without a helicopter and people there have no money for antibiotics. So doctors without borders are doing there best, but it's still there (among other places). The vaccine for spreading misinformation is education, but sadly people prefer to get their knowledge from tiktok while letting AI do their school work, if they go to school at all.

It didn't disappear btw. The black death wasn't 1 round of disease that killed everyone. There were waves of it and the big one in Europe wasn't the first or last deadly outbreak. It is still around but thanks to antibiotics it is mostly a non issue.

When I was stationed in Colorado, we were doing our exercise in an open field of grass, rolling around, doing push-ups and sit-ups etc, when someone ran up and told the person running the formation that we needed to move because plague had been discovered in the prairie dog droppings all over the base, just like the ones we were apparently rolling around in

Fun times

Right, we still regularly have cases.

Just completely ignores history, changes in human hygiene, and developments in medicine that weren't vaccines ("let's just ignore antiserums, sulphonamides, and streptomycin!").

How did it only kill 1/3, did many people survive it?

Some people didn’t get it and some had the right genes to fight off the disease. Those genes have now been linked to autoimmune diseases https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/genes-protective-during-the-black-death-may-now-be-increasing-autoimmune-disorders-202212012859

Also, the Black Plague has not been eradicated. It still exists in small mammals such as gophers and rats, and a strain could potentially mutate to humans again, although changes in human hygiene have made blood to blood infections less common.

The reason it seemed to disappear is because the more infectious and fatal strains spread to and killed off every susceptible human at a rate that could not support its propagation to new healthy humans.

It actually still exists in people too, it's just rare and treatable with antibiotics.

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/seriously-dont-worry-about-the-plague

Plague: Then vs now

It's rare because we have higher hygiene standards. Basically washing our hands eliminated the black plague.

I'm just going to Edit this comment because I don't feel the need to explain to every idiot commenting "ACKSTUALLY."
My comment was an over simplification. By having higher hygiene standards we reduced our contact with rats and other things that can carry it. It is essentially “We did A, which caused B through G, which lead to less of H.” If you don't understand or see the connection then that isn't my fault, blame your education.

More like fleas and other biting insects are more rare, and people generally do not tolerate sleeping around non-pet rats. It's more living conditions than hygene.

Basically washing our hands eliminated the black plague.

That’s not how it was spread, not really. It was spread by fleas and other blood to blood contact if the person had the bubonic plague and, in later stages, through the air in close contact via infectious respiratory droplets if the person had the pneumonic plague.

My comment was an over simplification. By having higher hygiene standards we reduced our contact with rats and other things that can carry it. It is essentially "We did A, which caused B through G, which lead to less of H."

Hygiene literally means practices that maintain health. Saying "we are healthy by maintaining better hygiene" literally means "We maintained our health by engaging in practices that maintained our health."

Your comment was partially incorrect. I corrected you. While it was a matter of hygiene, washing hands had little to nothing to do with it. You didn’t mention anything about rats or the fleas they carried, which were the primary carrier of the bubonic plague

I implore you to understand what an over simplification statement mean in regard to a multi step process that took centuries of understanding what to do and not to do. What conditions are considered acceptable now vs 700 years ago and so on.

An oversimplification doesn't mean you get to make completely false statements. An oversimplification ignores other significant factors to end up with a simple statement that for the most part is true.

It's rare because we have higher hygiene standards

This is an acceptable oversimplification.

Basically washing our hands eliminated the black plague.

This is not because this is just factually wrong.

The latter is what is being corrected. Now apply your smartass education and understand when you're wrong.

In an era of anti-vax bullshit, it's not acceptable to be that incorrect in your "oversimplification".

I understand what “oversimplification” means. You do not seem to understand what “incorrect“ means.

Got a rodent problem? Just wash your hands!

Sure would have been nice to know this when my house got invested with fleas. No need to flea bomb, I just needed to wash my hands!

(got a pup from a household with inadequate flea control measures--they'd give him a flea bath weekly, but never treated the environment or their cats. They swore up and down he didn't have fleas.)

I take it you just have the pup, so this tip might be for any cat owners passing by:

I've found to treat cats for fleas the best method is a flea comb and a tub of very bubbly soapy water.

The cat doesn't go in the water, instead you sit the cat on your lap, comb it's fur gently with the flea comb, and when you spot a flea on the comb, you dunk it in the bubbly soapy water.

...the slimey soapy bubbles capture the fleas, and make it a lot harder for them to escape. Turns a traumatic soggy moggy time, into a nice gentle combing kill session.

I assume you mean well, but this is serious "confidently incorrect" energy. Yersinia pestis, the bacteria that causes bubonic plague, never changed to become less virulent and can still affect humans to this day. It has been killing a ton of humans for thousands of years and was still killing thousands of people at a time in localized outbreaks up until we discovered the antibiotics that cure it.

Also, it's transmitted through the fleas on small mammals, not through the mammals themselves. Flea transmission is far and away the primary vector. Human to human transmission has always been pretty rare, since it can only be transmitted between humans through contact with bodily fluids, similar to how HIV spreads.

the more infectious and fatal strains spread to and killed off every susceptible human at a rate that could not support its propagation to new healthy humans

Plague Inc. has taught me how to be more effective and prevent this from happening.

Evolve Necrosis FTW. Gotta have corpse-to-living tx. The real problem with plague inc. is the motivation though the disease is likely dead one turn after humanity.

This is where we need a conspiracy theory that all complex life is just an intricate biological shell/animate castle-o-saurus, designed to protect and nourish a few self replicating acids, with defense mechanisms to try to kill any interlopers that seek to replicate faster without dissuading anything sexually compatible.

Sounds like the novel Parasite Eve which inspired a movie and later videogame series. Basically it piggy backs on the concept of Mitochondrial Eve wherein Mitocondria evolved separately from all other cellular life and exists as a symbiotic organism.

The Black Plague was truly a horror, but it DID break the back of Catholicism in Europe, so that's nice. Every cloud has a silver lining

It broke feudalism, too, and kickstarted the renaissance.

How so? Didn’t Luther do that a couple hundred years later?

At the time of the plague, the Catholic church dominated every state politically; they were the undisputed masters of Europe.

After the plague, they never recovered the same amount of control again. This was the start of a long decline that continues to this day. The plague revealed how truly ineffectual and predatory the church was, even to the most ignorant.

Recommend the books The Black Death and The Dancing Plague, I'm over simplifying of course there are many other details.

So what youre saying is it was gods will for the church to decline and it was done via the plague which must have come from God if everything is part of God's plan, which means God wanted fewer followers and eventually have none?

PRECISELY

Which black death book? There are many and I'd like to learn.

I'm assuming dancing plague is John Waller?

My memory fails me, here's what I have found on my bookshelf from the last few years

The Great Mortality: An Intimate History of the Black Death, the Most Devastating Plague of All Time by Kelly

The Dancing Plague: The Strange, True Story of an Extraordinary Illness by Waller

The Black Death 1346-1353: The Complete History by Benedictow

that continues to this day.

The US disagrees as do some theocratic states like Iran (nit-pick but i said catholic all you want, they all look the same to me).

THE GOOD NEWS The last time I looked, they're all shrinking in membership.

Also, remember, they have always lied about their predominance, and they always will. Abrahamics have no relationship with the truth, don't ever listen to them and their claims, believe nothing without solid evidence from another source.

Do not mistake the bullshit narrative of the oligarchs with actual human beings. Religion is dying everywhere amongst actual human beings.

So sick of seeing confidently incorrect people opining, using historical examples, when they have never before cracked open a history book and have no idea of the context.

So sick of seeing confidently incorrect people opining, using historical examples, when they have never before cracked open a history book and have no idea of the context.

This has always been the case through history.

The issue is Twitter boosts them over less engaging experts. The new problem is the medium. Twitter is not a fair forum, and these takes trend deliberately.

...And I think its really important for scientists (or anyone who believes in science) to recognize that. With all due respect, I do not understand, with everything that's happened, why they still keep using Twitter.

Legitimately, what else would they use? Hardly anyone uses Mastodon - I don't for sure, but from what I hear, the devs continually ignore the needs that people keep asking about. Which is why so many turned to Bluesky - it works.

To discuss the Threadiverse that I am much more familiar with, literally 100% of the people that I've told about "Lemmy" have outright chided me for having told them about it. (1) If you Google'd that term (not DuckDuckGo, I'm talking mainstream normies here) a year ago, it would take you to lemmy.ml; (2) that instance by default does not show All, but rather Local; (3) lemmy.ml - along with lemmygrad.ml and hexbear.net - routinely calls for the murder of everyone participating in a capitalist, Western society (Edit: not just billionaires, or even millionaires, but anyone who participates). And showing Local rather than All does not dilute that flood as much as you see your view of the Threadiverse content from lemmy.world. (4) no major Lemmy instances defederate from lemmy.ml (quokk.au did iirc, before it switched all the way over to PieFed).

There are some MAJOR structural issues with the Fediverse that need to be solved first, before mainstream normies - who remember are primarily centrist (aka liberal to even right-wing by the standards here) - will feel comfortable here. Not celebrating and calling for their literal irl murder might be a start. (Note that while YOU might have such communities and user accounts blocked, a guest account, especially browsing lemmy.ml, cannot and would not know how to deal with such - e.g. a new account on most instances could respond to comments in Chapotraphouse@hexbear.net while browsing All and have no idea what they are walking into... then noping out and worst of all, telling everyone that will listen how extremist we are here)

We are a Nazi bar here, except instead of Nazis it's tankies. Also, purity beatings will continue until morale improves. Mainstream people do not feel welcomed here. And most people seem unable to even say so much as they should be? Would you want more "right-wing" people here? (I actually mean centrists, but especially in the USA where so many are located, that is more where they would lean, right?)

Edit: so to answer your question, they use Xhitter the same way that we use the Threadiverse - by blocking early and blocking often, and putting up with what the remainder of stuff that they do not like, in order to make some use of what is freely offered to them, especially requiring minimal efforts to overcome their existing inertia.

Henry Ford believed the Elders of Zion, and he was a cultural icon in business, which I assume meant he was top tier intelligent at the time.

"One death is a tragedy. A million deaths is a statistic."

These people would care more if they personally get hurt.

depending on the person, one death could also be a party

Doesn't have to be one, I've made a list

Oh I am partying once Trump keels over. Absolutely no shame admitting that.

That why a rhetorical tool that personalizes death may work.

Something like "okay, your mother is now dead. And now your wife, and auntie and even your old highschool girlfriend. You watch them all die, bewildered and distraught, but you do nothing until your son dies in front of you, choking on a resporator, pleading in his eyes until the very end."

"You can stop the rest of your family dying right now right now, right way. you can even save your own life, in a way that will also save other peoples mothers, wifes, and sons. Will you?"

Let me tell you about my mother.

Well, you aint gonna win them all, but something like the above tends to work when people talk about how "some people" should die or go somewhere else. Bringing it back from "somebody" to "you and everyone you know" tends to shock that talk out of them.

Oh I’m just referencing blade runner.

Your story really reminds me of the Voight-Kampff test.

Its effectivly an empathy test just like voight-kampff, so I see where you're coming from.

Capillary dilation of the so-called blush response? Fluctuation of the pupil. Involuntary dilation of the iris...

JD Vance cheering on the Bubonic Plague.

It also killed between 10% and 100% (average of a 3rd or so) of populated areas every 10 years for about 600 years. So ~3x longer than the US has been around.

But I assume that nobody at the time had autism, because they were not vaccinated. Worth it!^/s^

That's because Tylenol didn't exist yet

It did not disappear. It's still posting on social media.

Kind of rude to talk about Kanye like that

I worked at a zoo for a bit and whenever we went in the prairie dogs enclosure we had to wear lowkey hazmat and fully sanitize before & after bc they can carry it

Uhhh penecilin? Also i think its still around, its just easilly treatable

Exactly this. Not only did it essentially wipe out entire populations and even drastically alter the course of civilizations (repeatedly), it has not "disappeared." It is still endemic in mammalian (mostly rodent+flea) populations in some areas including in the US. Every year there are people who get infected with it. I think it's an average of like 7 people per year in the US, but as usual, countries more heavily exploited by the US and its vassals get it worse. Hundreds of cases per year in DRC for example. It's hasn't "disappeared," this antivaxxer nitwit just doesn't know about it because modern medicine has made it treatable and precluded its ability to spread as it did in previous centuries.

https://www.cdc.gov/plague/maps-statistics/index.html

Bubonic plague is still a thing.

In 2022, the possible origin of all modern strains of Yersinia pestis was found in DNA in human remains in three graves located in Kyrgyzstan, dated to 1338 and 1339. The first recorded occurrence of the Black Death occurred shortly thereafter during the siege of Caffa in Crimea in 1346, and was carried to Europe by boat by people attempting to escape the disease. The strain was identified as the most recent common ancestor of both strains found in historic graves and currently existing strains.

Holy shit that's wild

The Black Death’s first recorded emergence was in Crimea in 1346, when an army laying siege to the city of Caffa, now known as Feodosia, catapulted disease-ridden corpses over the walls. Those fleeing the resulting outbreak of plague by boat took the disease to Europe.

Honest mistake

This is why we need Trump's anti-immigration policies, to prevent another pandemic from entering the USA. It worked back in his first term, right?

Yeah but what has it done for you lately

Wouldn’t the proper follow up have been: ”and so did 1/3 of Europe”?

It also disappeared without plumbed toilets and water purification.

where it kept coming back periodically for 500 years

In today's installment of it's always projection: This is why Republicans project that the left is a death cult.

Wasn't one of the reasons was realization hygiene was important so helped cut down on spread of it after a while?

i think multifactorial and all the rats eventually died out or something, due to reintroduction of especially terrier dogs/cats. also likely brown rats displaced the black rats.

~~I mean it did disappear without a vaccine, so it's not technically misinformation ...~~

~~(it disappeared because of antibiotics, which is technically a different thing)~~

edit: nvm

Plague still exists mostly as a problem in poor countries without access to antibiotics. I think sheep get it too and it's a problem in livestock.

Also there was a large plague vaccination program in India in the 1890s

It's Europe's fault for being so weak. Better tell me how many Americans have died because of it!

The Black Death (bubonic plague) that devastated Europe and Asia in the 14th century did not occur on the American continent.

However, a later, separate outbreak of the bubonic plague was introduced to the Americas around 1900, resulting in the following recorded deaths:

United States (1900-1904): The first major outbreak in San Francisco killed at least 119 to 172 people.

United States (1900–2015): A total of 1,036 human plague cases were reported in the U.S. during this period.

United States (1900-1942): Before antibiotics, there were 511 cases, of which 336 were fatal (66% mortality rate).

United States (Recent): In recent decades, an average of seven human plague cases are reported in the U.S. each year. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention | CDC (.gov)

Key Facts on Plague in the Americas: Origin: The plague arrived in the US on rat-infested steamships from Asia, primarily affecting West Coast port cities.

Endemic Status: The disease established itself among wild rodents in the Western US (especially New Mexico, Arizona, California, and Colorado).

Location: While rare, modern plague cases in the Americas occur primarily in the United States and Peru. Smithsonian Magazine

I've got to appreciate a serious fact check under my half-assed joke. Thank you, that was genuinely interesting.

I prefer people who survive the plague 🤷‍♂️

Does anyone have any recommendations on books about the black plague?

Let's not get lost in the details

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