This has happened so many times
(midwest.social)
Spectre
MemesThe thing I think is that Iran is indeed an authoritarian theocratic regime and killed 3000 people confirmed by themselves, but so is Israel. The problem is the ipocricy in the judgement of a nation that should before look at it self and get that it's not better than others. But we all know this
Most of those were civilians and security forces (2427 out of 3117). The other numbers floating around seem completely made up by NGOs and western media so it's hard to know if there are more dead rioters.
Palestine also.
/s Yes they lied about Iraq but Iran is an authoritarian state that should be toppled. Two things can be true at once you know.
So many "fell for it again" awards need to be handed out these past few years.
What happens after it is toppled?
That's the problem
Democracy ofc then ISIS but one thing at a time /s
you know, installing some al-qaeda dissident on power but he's totally fine now since he uses a suit.
Typical imperial core chauvinism. They know their governments are evil but still cling hard to the idea that they're the best therefore every non western aligned country must be even more evil.
"If my country is evil while calling itself the leader of the free world, other countries must be super evil"
Iranian state tv gave an official death toll of 3117. from aljazeera, famously pro US outlet.
Correct, there have been thousands of deaths, not the fantastical numbers in the 10s of thousands reported by Hasbara accounts and western media, and not the result of the IRGC one-sidedly slaughtering people en masse but intense riots and turmoil. Exaggerating tragedies and changing the nature of real events is exactly how western atrocity propaganda functions.
that’s still pretty damn far from the 30'000 that’s floating around in western media
yes it is, not saying it isn't
I'd guess the real number is cliser to hrnwa which is around 10k
"I'm more comfortable trusting the CIA funded outlets without any evidence, I am very impartial"
Why guess a number without better information?
What was the lie about Ukraine?
Russia didn't invade Ukraine?
The invasion was completely unprompted and nothing happened in the years immediately preceding it.
There's a few to choose from. Like the war started in 2022. Ukraine doesn't have a nazi problem. Euromaidan didn't have any western interference. Zelensky doesn't have Epstein ties.
I know we like to spread misinformation online on this here .ml instance, but that might be too much even for you. Also, everyone knows that the war technicality started in 2014 when putin did the first invasion, I don't even understand what kind of gotcha that might be
Which part of QinShiHuangsSchlong's comment was misinformation? Can you articulate how and why? Further, the war started as a consequence of Donetsk and Luhansk seceding from Kiev into the Donetsk People's Republic and Luhansk People's Republic, following the far-right western-backed coup of Yanukovych. Once the Banderites took power and started oppressing ethnic Russians, the DPR and LPR seceded.
Which part of QinShiHuangsSchlong’s comment was misinformation?
I'll bite.
Like the war started in 2022
The only people saying that are the clueless Americans. Everybody in Europe understands that the war started in 2014 when russia invaded Donbas, Luhansk, and Crimea.
Ukraine doesn’t have a nazi problem
Ukraine has as much of a Nazi problem as the US, France, Germany, Poland, or any other country on the planet. Sure, there definitely are Neo-Nazis there - like everywhere else. But the narrative was that the government was "overrun" by them, where in fact the most right-wing party received 6% in 2014 and less than 2% in 2019. Meaning, as of right now, there no fundamentalist right-wingers in the parliament, much less so in the government.
Euromaidan didn’t have any western interference
Define "western interference".
People sending food and blankets to the protesters? Yeah, there was that.
Western governments silently supporting whoever opposed Yanukovych? Possibly, maybe. But those people weren't really doing much.
CIA/Mossad inciting the streets to rebel against the government in an attempt to coup Yanukovych and install a pro-western ruler? Yeah, that one's lunacy. Yanukovych got in power because he promised a more pro-western route in politics, the people wanted to be a part of the EU and NATO since 2001. Then, in 2013 things were starting to look really promising for Ukraine, and exactly then Putin ordered Yanukovych to reverse course, because he was afraid about his oil contracts. When Yanukovych did that, people went to the streets.
Zelensky doesn’t have Epstein ties
None of the to-date released documents mention him as a guest or client of Epstein, so I don't even know where is this coming from.
Further, the war started as a consequence of Donetsk and Luhansk seceding from Kiev into the Donetsk People’s Republic and Luhansk People’s Republic
The "secession" was made by russian troops illegally entering the sovereign territory of Ukraine. The "referendums" were made under threat of violence from armed russian soldiers.
The reality is that the war started because Ukrainians wanted to join the West, found oil and gas reserves and already had contracts with BP and Shell for extraction, all the while Moscow's contracts were expiring in 2023.
Once the Banderites took power and started oppressing ethnic Russians, the DPR and LPR seceded.
That's one of the most hilarious things I've read in a while :D
The only people saying that are the clueless Americans. Everybody in Europe understands that the war started in 2014 when russia invaded Donbas, Luhansk, and Crimea.
But this is wrong, still. Crimea joined the Russian Federation, and Donetsk and Luhansk seceded, in response to the far-right Banderite coup.
Ukraine has as much of a Nazi problem as the US, France, Germany, Poland, or any other country on the planet. Sure, there definitely are Neo-Nazis there - like everywhere else. But the narrative was that the government was “overrun” by them, where in fact the most right-wing party received 6% in 2014 and less than 2% in 2019. Meaning, as of right now, there no fundamentalist right-wingers in the parliament, much less so in the government.
The Banderites were the ones that overthrew Yanukovych, and as a consequence have been emboldened by the state. The far-right governs Ukraine.
Define “western interference”.
People sending food and blankets to the protesters? Yeah, there was that.
Western governments silently supporting whoever opposed Yanukovych? Possibly, maybe. But those people weren’t really doing much.
CIA/Mossad inciting the streets to rebel against the government in an attempt to coup Yanukovych and install a pro-western ruler? Yeah, that one’s lunacy. Yanukovych got in power because he promised a more pro-western route in politics, the people wanted to be a part of the EU and NATO since 2001. Then, in 2013 things were starting to look really promising for Ukraine, and exactly then Putin ordered Yanukovych to reverse course, because he was afraid about his oil contracts. When Yanukovych did that, people went to the streets.
From @yogthos@lemmy.ml
- Reuters, 2014: Leaked audio reveals embarrassing U.S. exchange on Ukraine, EU https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSBREA151VA/
- Leaked recording between Nuland and Pyatt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoW75J5bnnE | transcript
- Counterpunch, 2014: US Imperialism and the Ukraine Coup https://www.counterpunch.org/2014/03/10/us-imperialism-and-the-ukraine-coup/
- Consortium News, 2015: The Mess That Nuland Made https://consortiumnews.com/2022/02/26/robert-parry-the-mess-that-nuland-made/
- Monthly Review Online, 2021: The Maidan massacre in Ukraine: revelations from trials and investigations https://mronline.org/2021/12/11/the-maidan-massacre-in-ukraine/
- Maidan coup thread https://archive.ph/BAxYc
- Coup details https://consortiumnews.com/2022/12/29/evidence-of-us-backed-coup-in-kiev/
- Don't Get it Wrong: Ukraine and "Israel" are Both Tools of US-EU Imperialism
- An article from August 2021 advocating inflicting a military defeat on Russia in Ukraine to subjugate it and draw it away from China https://nationalinterest.org/feature/strategy-avoiding-two-front-war-192137
- An important piece that reveals Washington, via CIA paramilitaries, has been fighting a proxy war against Russia in the Donbas since, it's implied, 2014. https://news.yahoo.com/exclusive-secret-cia-training-program-in-ukraine-helped-kyiv-prepare-for-russian-invasion-090052743.html
- NYT coup coverage with CIA involvement https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/25/world/europe/cia-ukraine-intelligence-russia-war.html
- Nordstream US involvement evidence https://thegrayzone.com/2023/06/27/evidence-nord-stream-underwater-expedition/
- The US harvesting Ukraine for minerals https://apnews.com/article/ukraine-us-rare-earth-minerals-deal-8566241ea0e121a30437d845357055d8
None of the to-date released documents mention him as a guest or client of Epstein, so I don’t even know where is this coming from.
Kiev is a gangster state with immense corruption. I haven't seen any direct Epstein ties, but it would be unsurprising.
The “secession” was made by russian troops illegally entering the sovereign territory of Ukraine. The “referendums” were made under threat of violence from armed russian soldiers.
The reality is that the war started because Ukrainians wanted to join the West, found oil and gas reserves and already had contracts with BP and Shell for extraction, all the while Moscow’s contracts were expiring in 2023.
Nah, this is bullshit. Yanukovych was very popular in the regions that seceded:
The Banderites wanted to move towards the imperialist west, but Yanukovych wanted to go with the Russian loan that didn't require austerity politics and impoverishing Ukrainians even further. That's why the west supported the coup.
That’s one of the most hilarious things I’ve read in a while :D
Laughter instead of responding isn't a point.
can you post the latest Time Magazine cover and point out its pushing war propaganda again ? thank you
I read this to the tune of Yakko's World
I'm no fan of American imperialism either but the regime in Iran is actively massacring their civilians on a scale never before seen during protests, I have Iranian friends and they know full well that America and Israel don't have their best interests at heart, and yet they still want them to intervene because they don't see any other way for change to happen. My Iranian friends don't even really like Reza Pahlavi but he's the most significant figure in these protests and so they're supporting him purely in solidarity with the people.
It's a very complicated and nuanced situation and it can't really be reduced to a meme like this without losing important context.
Hahaha you're literally doing the thing. Good stuff
"My Venezuelan friends are celebrating"
Imagine having a nuanced opinion? Crazy
Nuance is when your opinions about other countries always coincidentally and conveniently line up with what the US government wants. Very nuanced, you incredible free thinker you.
Nuanced, like celebrating civilians from your own country being bombed 🤓
How many countries do you have to destroy before you stop falling for regime change justifications?
Don't misunderstand, I'm not American, I don't support America, in my personal and professional life I've been making every reasonable effort to decouple my life from America (hence why I'm on Lemmy)
I didn't even say that I support America invading.
The reality of Iran is that every few years since the 1979 revolution the people become discontent enough to start protesting, and every time the government harshly cracks down on those protests, and in both the process and the after math, many people are killed by the government for protesting. That's an oversimplification but serves to illustrate my point.
My knowledge and understanding is based on my Iranian friends, who fled the country as refugees and left their friends and families behind, because of the oppressive government.
Those same friends do not like America, but they aren't left with any other options but to support America. Not a day goes by that they don't complain about the willful ignorance of the European Union and the world at large for being silent, only last week did the EU even decide to label the IRGC as a terrorist group.
The UN and international courts should be the ones trying to intervene and at the very least stop the regime killing tens of thousands of their own people.
Don't bother, mate. This is crazy people country, I don't think you can reason with those dudes...
